Am I to believe Google classroom isn't storing my students information, from as young as 3rd grade, to sell to 3rd parties once they turn 18? Or am I naive to think they aren't already selling it while they are literally children?
If your student has a google account created by the school using Google for Education, then their data is not being used for ads. And if their admins delete your student account after they graduate (as they should) then their data is truly gone (after a relatively short retention period).
Now if you have a student using a non Google for Education account, then Google will store and use their data for ad targeting after they turn 18. Also if they lie about their age when they create their account (which is very likely, especially because Google doesn't allow you to create an account with age less than 13) then this will kick in sooner. In addition even though ad personalization is off for under 18 and advertisers are not supposed to target them by other means, they can and do by targetting search terms, youtube categories etc that under 18s are frequently interested in.
(FWIW Google never really "sells" your data. That would loose their monopoly on their most valued asset. It's more like they rent it out, but allowing advertisers to target you. The advertisers never actually get to see "person X has attribute ABC", more like the advertiser says "target people with ABC" and they trust google to show it people like that.)
> The advertisers never actually get to see "person X has attribute ABC", more like the advertiser says "target people with ABC" and they trust google to show it people like that.)
Only if you never click. Once you click they know.
"If your student has a google account created by the school using Google for Education, then their data is not being used for ads" - then how do they make money? Is Google classroom free for schools?
Yes it's free. And yes it's not making money. They do have phenomenal education resources for teachers that are paid, though.
It's about getting them baked into the google ecosystem. Microsoft did this in the 90's, but with businesses instead of schools (and not for free to be honest).
Get them used to Google so they use nothing but Google when they're adults. Then monetization happens.
I've worked in the education sector—at least in the US there are well known data protection laws that schools very much do know about and attempt to comply with. It's not quite HIPAA levels of serious, but they do take it seriously, and as another commenter notes Google actually does comply.
I remember a teacher telling us that parents should not check their kids Google classroom accounts because it would be a violation of the other students’ privacy. I understand what they were saying but there’s no way I’m not checking my kid’s Google classroom account. Ridiculous.
Most kids just stay logged as as their google classroom email, so that includes search/youtube/etc. Of course Google is tracking all that usage and targeting them for ads.
By the time they turn 18, Google will have such a perfect model of who they are. Will sell to the CIA, FBI etc. Complete profiles of how citizens think. Really evil stuff.
You are either being dishonest or are just ignorant. User data is disclosed to advertisers when they auction for ad placement. Many of those advertisers then sell the user data they collect through the auction, whether or not they win the auction, to other parties. It's a virtual certainty the FBI, CIA, NSA etc purchase that information.
Your argument is basically Google didn't do anything wrong because they are not the direct point of sale. But they aren't fools. They know what happens to the data they disclose to advertisers. It's repackaged and sold again.
Tracking isn't the kind of thing where once you cross some threshold there's no point in caring. Even if your kid's schoolwork habits are all bundled and sold to advertisers, protecting their privacy in other areas remains just as valuable.
Sarcasm? "Even if your kids schoolwork habits are all bundled and sold to advertisers". I think by that point we have done such a shameful job of protecting the privacy of children that we should put our heads down and throw in the towel. Not to mention all that data being fed into Gemini, profited off of.
No point in protecting whatever private crumbs remain. Requires a full social reset. Imo.
What is a "full social reset"? Ideally I'd prefer to make incremental progress on privacy, but if you pinned me down and made me choose between accepting the status quo and abolishing all networked education apps, I'd pick the status quo. They have real benefits and I wish they'd been around when I was a kid.
This is one of the situations where I would use a more baity title: "Protect your teen from non-consensual ad tracking". The subject is boring and abstract enough that you need all the trigger words you can muster to garner the interest of the public at large.
This is the larger problem with discussions on privacy. Anti privacy articles are often very emotionally charged “Apple REFUSES to unlock killers iPhone”, and pro-privacy ones are more neutral like “Why end to end encryption is important”.
I understand the attempt to remain neutral sounding, but all that’s doing is making it easier for people to ignore.
I would hazard to guess that Google classroom (starting at Kindergarten and continuing through post secondary) software is mostly installed via next-next-finish (i.e. whatever the defaults set by Google are). I'd also assume that these defaults are set to very minimal privacy protection for students.
Having this digital record entrusted to any company that is not under strong privacy controls should be frightening to parents.
School administrators figure the low-cost low-barrier-to-entry is well worth the long term privacy risk to children.
* Fortunately my children were out of school when this became common place - so kindly correct me if I'm mistaken.
Cats gotta be out of the bag long by now.
Am I to believe Google classroom isn't storing my students information, from as young as 3rd grade, to sell to 3rd parties once they turn 18? Or am I naive to think they aren't already selling it while they are literally children?
If your student has a google account created by the school using Google for Education, then their data is not being used for ads. And if their admins delete your student account after they graduate (as they should) then their data is truly gone (after a relatively short retention period).
Now if you have a student using a non Google for Education account, then Google will store and use their data for ad targeting after they turn 18. Also if they lie about their age when they create their account (which is very likely, especially because Google doesn't allow you to create an account with age less than 13) then this will kick in sooner. In addition even though ad personalization is off for under 18 and advertisers are not supposed to target them by other means, they can and do by targetting search terms, youtube categories etc that under 18s are frequently interested in.
(FWIW Google never really "sells" your data. That would loose their monopoly on their most valued asset. It's more like they rent it out, but allowing advertisers to target you. The advertisers never actually get to see "person X has attribute ABC", more like the advertiser says "target people with ABC" and they trust google to show it people like that.)
> The advertisers never actually get to see "person X has attribute ABC", more like the advertiser says "target people with ABC" and they trust google to show it people like that.)
Only if you never click. Once you click they know.
"If your student has a google account created by the school using Google for Education, then their data is not being used for ads" - then how do they make money? Is Google classroom free for schools?
Yes it's free. And yes it's not making money. They do have phenomenal education resources for teachers that are paid, though.
It's about getting them baked into the google ecosystem. Microsoft did this in the 90's, but with businesses instead of schools (and not for free to be honest).
Get them used to Google so they use nothing but Google when they're adults. Then monetization happens.
Yes, but there are enterprise-y tiers that are paid.
> because Google doesn't allow you to create an account with age less than 13
Actually you can - you create the account under FamilyLink.
See here: https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338
That’s my biggest concern. Schools have no idea.
I've worked in the education sector—at least in the US there are well known data protection laws that schools very much do know about and attempt to comply with. It's not quite HIPAA levels of serious, but they do take it seriously, and as another commenter notes Google actually does comply.
I remember a teacher telling us that parents should not check their kids Google classroom accounts because it would be a violation of the other students’ privacy. I understand what they were saying but there’s no way I’m not checking my kid’s Google classroom account. Ridiculous.
Certainly not siding with Big G here, but the onus is on the school. They should be able to be held accountable.
Most kids just stay logged as as their google classroom email, so that includes search/youtube/etc. Of course Google is tracking all that usage and targeting them for ads.
By the time they turn 18, Google will have such a perfect model of who they are. Will sell to the CIA, FBI etc. Complete profiles of how citizens think. Really evil stuff.
this is a lie and you feel ashamed and stop spreading it. Google doesn't sell profles period and doesn't sell data to the fbi/cia
The only evil here is you spreading false info
Well, we all know about Prism, the Google law enforcement portal, subpoenas and national security letters. Do those four not cover their description?
i wouldn’t claim sale, but was prism a lie?
You are either being dishonest or are just ignorant. User data is disclosed to advertisers when they auction for ad placement. Many of those advertisers then sell the user data they collect through the auction, whether or not they win the auction, to other parties. It's a virtual certainty the FBI, CIA, NSA etc purchase that information.
Your argument is basically Google didn't do anything wrong because they are not the direct point of sale. But they aren't fools. They know what happens to the data they disclose to advertisers. It's repackaged and sold again.
For what it's worth since the DMA went into effect in Europe, you can now turn off sharing between almost all Google services.
https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/14202892
Tracking isn't the kind of thing where once you cross some threshold there's no point in caring. Even if your kid's schoolwork habits are all bundled and sold to advertisers, protecting their privacy in other areas remains just as valuable.
Sarcasm? "Even if your kids schoolwork habits are all bundled and sold to advertisers". I think by that point we have done such a shameful job of protecting the privacy of children that we should put our heads down and throw in the towel. Not to mention all that data being fed into Gemini, profited off of.
No point in protecting whatever private crumbs remain. Requires a full social reset. Imo.
What is a "full social reset"? Ideally I'd prefer to make incremental progress on privacy, but if you pinned me down and made me choose between accepting the status quo and abolishing all networked education apps, I'd pick the status quo. They have real benefits and I wish they'd been around when I was a kid.
This is one of the situations where I would use a more baity title: "Protect your teen from non-consensual ad tracking". The subject is boring and abstract enough that you need all the trigger words you can muster to garner the interest of the public at large.
This is the larger problem with discussions on privacy. Anti privacy articles are often very emotionally charged “Apple REFUSES to unlock killers iPhone”, and pro-privacy ones are more neutral like “Why end to end encryption is important”.
I understand the attempt to remain neutral sounding, but all that’s doing is making it easier for people to ignore.
The best minds of our generation are being used to stalk children in order to sell their data to autocrats and monopolists.
Digital Moloch.
I would hazard to guess that Google classroom (starting at Kindergarten and continuing through post secondary) software is mostly installed via next-next-finish (i.e. whatever the defaults set by Google are). I'd also assume that these defaults are set to very minimal privacy protection for students.
Having this digital record entrusted to any company that is not under strong privacy controls should be frightening to parents.
School administrators figure the low-cost low-barrier-to-entry is well worth the long term privacy risk to children.
* Fortunately my children were out of school when this became common place - so kindly correct me if I'm mistaken.
Google for education has very thorough and strict privacy controls. They have to, most states have pretty strict laws around that anymore.
If only Congress realized that some of these advertisers and data brokers answer to the CCP ... maybe we could have a tracking-free internet.
> If only Congress realized that some of these advertisers and data brokers answer to the CCP ... maybe we could have a tracking-free internet.
Yes, but Google, Microsoft and Meta answer to Uncle Sam. Why intetfere with their business ? /s
You kid but perhaps https://www.vulnu.com/p/government-wiretaps-in-u-s-internet-...
[flagged]
> Much of Congress answers to the CCP too
What nonsense. No it doesn’t. By the same standard of evidence, the CCP answers to American interests.
[flagged]